CLEVELAND, Ohio — In this episode of the Wine and Gold Talk podcast, Ethan Sands and Jimmy Watkins delve into the impact of early season injuries on the Cavs and how head coach Kenny Atkinson might adjust the team’s strategy, potentially leaning more on De’Andre Hunter and Evan Mobley.
Discover how these changes could influence the Cavs’ offensive dynamics and the early opportunities that could shape playoff decisions.
Takeaways:
1. Load Management vs. Playoff Preparedness
The podcast discussed the Cavaliers’ approach to load management during the regular season. While the team was celebrated for saving mileage on their players by limiting minutes and blowing teams out, this strategy may have backfired in the playoffs when players weren’t conditioned for playoff intensity and Evan Mobley (ankle), De’Andre Hunter (thumb), Darius Garland (toe), and Donovan Mitchell (calf strain) were dealing with injuries. Jimmy Watkins referenced Tom Thibodeau’s contrasting philosophy of preparing players’ bodies during the regular season for playoff demands, suggesting there might be a middle ground between excessive rest and overplaying.
2. Team’s Offseason Preparation
The Cavaliers held pre-camp workouts together in August, with all but three players participating in collective training in Los Angeles. These sessions included beach runs, gym work, and team-building activities to build camaraderie and chemistry. The team also announced they’re returning to IMG Academy for training camp. This collective approach to offseason preparation demonstrates the team’s commitment to improvement after consecutive second-round playoff exits.
3. Kenny Atkinson’s Second Season Advantage
Unlike his first summer when he was “running around like a chicken with his head cut off,” coach Kenny Atkinson now has a complete summer to develop relationships with players and better understand their capabilities. This familiarity allows him to build on what he learned about players’ body types, mindsets, and physical limitations. The hosts expect Atkinson to implement another structured rest plan for the 2025-2026 season, but with refinements based on last season’s experiences.
4. De’Andre Hunter’s Crucial Role
De’Andre Hunter is expected to take on Ty Jerome’s role as a consistent scoring threat for the bench unit. The hosts emphasized that Hunter needs to become a better facilitator, noting he has never averaged more than two assists per season in his career. His mid-range game is highlighted as particularly strong, but concerns exist about ball movement potentially stopping with him since he tends to take shots rather than pass when he sees opportunities.
5. Evan Mobley as the Key to Championship Contention
The hosts identified Evan Mobley as potentially the most important player for the Cavaliers this season, suggesting he should touch the ball “almost every time down the floor.” They argued that while Donovan Mitchell is a top-15 NBA player, the Cavaliers cannot advance past the Eastern Conference semifinals without Mobley becoming the team’s number one option. His development needs to accelerate for the team to reach championship contender status.
6. Offensive Diversification Necessity
With injuries to Darius Garland and Max Strus to start the season, plus the departure of Ty Jerome, the Cavaliers will need to diversify their offense beyond guard-heavy play. The hosts suggested increased roles for De’Andre Hunter, Evan Mobley, and Jarrett Allen, with particular emphasis on developing two-man game actions between these players. The question remains whether this diversified approach will continue once injured guards return or if the team will revert to guard-dominated offense.
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Transcript
NOTE: This transcript was generated by artificial intelligence and could contain misspellings and errors.
Ethan Sands: What up Chaos Nation? I’m your host, Ethan Sands and I’m back with another episode of the Wine and Gold Talk podcast. Joining me today. You know him, you love them. Jimmy Watkins, cleveland.com’s columnist and we are here to answer questions from our subtexters when it gets into a non hey Chris Episode of the podcast because Chris is not with us. The first question from our subtexters is there’s a YouTube video of Evan Mobley working out with his trainer and someone says he was working back from an ankle injury. Did he get hurt at some point this off season? No. Evan Mobley was hurt during the Eastern Conference semifinals against the Indiana Pacers where he sat out Game two at home where the Cavs had Donovan Mitchell go ballistic but were not able to pull on that victory and that ended up ultimately changing the series. But Evan Mobley, DeAndre Hunter and Darius Garland all were out for various reasons of Game 2. DeAndre Hunter his thumb, Darius Garland his toe, and Evan Mobley was his ankle. And at the time I remember Chris reporting on this thinking that the least likely to return was Evan Mobley because of the severity of his ankle injury, how he was moving and also the travel that were to come in Game three to go out to Indianapolis. I just thought it was one a test of resilience for Evan Mobley to be able to come back and showcase what he was capable of even if he was hindered. But yeah, the beginning of his offseason training was getting back healthy, fully healthy, retraining that ankle and then for him, getting in the weight room, getting back on the court and then also getting on the track. Also in that video that you’re referencing because over the last couple of years we’ve seen Evan Mobley working on his speed, working on his endurance, working on his on the track to get better when it comes to getting up and down the floor. And I think that’s going to help Evan when it comes to this coming season because of his ball handling duties being increased. And we saw last year he was working with a tennis ball in some videos. This year he was working with a basketball on a track. Quick answer to that question. Evan Mobley had an ankle injury in the Eastern Conference semifinals. Pretty much straightforward with that.
Jimmy Watkins: Yeah, he was hurt during the playoffs. I got nothing more to add there.
Ethan Sands: Getting to this next question coming from James in Nebraska who says, I don’t care about the last five guys on the roster. I do care about the Cavs ability to compete in the playoffs. How much of the Cavs playoffs offensive and defensive ineffectiveness were because they weren’t in good enough shape. What are the Cavs doing to be stronger, faster and healthier for the playoffs? I think there’s a double edged sword here, Jimmy. As we just referenced with Evan Mobley, there were three guys that are in the top seven of the Cavs lineups that were simply not at a hundred percent. Also, you can reference Donovan Mitchell, who was playing through a calf strain at this point as well for the second playoffs in a row playing through a calf strain. So no, they were not at 100%. No, they were not fully healthy. No, they were not in the best shape because their bodies were fighting themselves. Right. That’s what I would take away from this. And the other part of it is the Indiana Pacers play at a blitzing speed. No team in the NBA really looked like they were able to keep up with the Indiana Pacers. The OKC Thunder did the best job of it, but it still took them to game seven to figure it out. And if Tyrese Haliburton gets to play the entirety of Game seven, there’s a completely different conversation because Tyrese Halliburton is driving that offense, is driving the transition game and him being out, it changed the entire series. Unfortunate for him. It had to happen. And in game seven of the NBA Finals.
Jimmy Watkins: That all being said, particularly the kind of injuries the Cavs had, I. I don’t know that I would necessarily attribute them directly to the fatigue that was associated with playing the Pacers. Right. Like Evan Landon on a guy’s foot. That’s bum luck. DeAndre Hunter. I got freaking closed heart. Like you can’t control that. I don’t know enough about toes to know whether Darius is injury was related to fatigue or not. But again, I would guess that that’s kind of a freak thing. Donovan’s calf strains. We. We kind of. We’ve been having a long conversation about Donovan’s calf strains. That. That is kind of like a. A load management injury and it’s been a recurring thing. The Cavs did everything they could last year to cut Donovan’s minutes. I don’t know what you do with that. Here’s what I’ll say. On the whole though, one of the conversations that kept coming again, yes, let’s. So we’ve acknowledged that the Cavs had injuries. That was a part of the Indiana series. Okay. We got that out of the way. They still look tired an awful lot, man. And I know, I know that playing 36, 37 minutes against the Pacers is not like playing 36, 37 minutes against everybody else. But it’s not like Kenny was pushing the limits of the rotation here. Okay, they were playing pretty normal playoff rotation minutes under not normal stylistic conditions for sure. I get it. But they did not look prepared to handle that. And it’s. I think it goes back to a conversation we’ve been having on the pod after the playoffs. Something that Kenny was asked about during that series, something that he got a little bit chippy about when he was asked about it, which is, did you play these guys enough during the regular season? We were celebrating all year how much the Cavs were saving mileage on their players. Oh, they’re blowing everybody out. Everyone’s playing 30 minutes a game. This is great. This is great. This is going to help them peak in the playoffs. Oops. Apparently there’s a point of no return here. Apparently there is some, some room on the spectrum between load management, rest everybody and Tom Thibodau running his small forward into the ground every year. Right. When to Tom Thibodeau was asked about this, I. I thought it was a fascinating answer. When the Knicks came to town, he was asked, you know, about the minutes. It was Ethan who asked it, actually. I think it was right after Mikhail Bridges had had kind of publicly called Tibbs out and saying like, hey man, play the bench, which is not what you want from one of your is paid players. And what Tib said is, I’m trying to get them their bodies prepared for what’s going to happen during the playoffs. I think that has, I mean, after watching that Pacer series, I think that has some validity to it too. Here’s. Here’s the tough part. It’s not a coincidence that Tibbs, his teams tend to struggle with injuries once they get to the playoffs and he plays those guys all those minutes during the regular season. I would also argue it’s not a coincidence that the Knicks were actually one of the healthier teams in the playoffs this year and were able to benefit from some of the other team’s injuries. And that tips plays all those guys live regular season minutes, like definitely room for some nuance there. And could McElbridge stand to play 40 minutes a game instead of fricking 45? Absolutely. Could your healthy versions of Evan Mobley, Darius Garland, Donovan Mitchell, Jared Allen stand to play, I don’t know, 34 minutes a game in the regular season instead of 30? I would also argue that there’s, that there’s room for that. And I would throw out another idea into the Ether here, that of the core four, I would argue that three of them. We have questions about can you handle the physicality of the playoffs? Do you need to get stronger? I think the injuries were mostly freak injuries. You know what helps you avoid injuries? Getting stronger.
Ethan Sands: Yeah, a thousand percent. And I think to answer, to go a little bit further for James and Nebraska’s questions, what are the Cavs doing? I mean, they were having pre camp workouts together in the month of August, right. And the Cavs just announced that they’re going back to IMG Academy for a training camp. But they were as a collective. Other than three players, everybody showed up to be a part of this pre camp workout in Los Angeles to not only build camaraderie and chemistry, but just to get work in. They were doing hails on a beach run, right? They were getting in work in a gym. They were together, they were competing, they were doing things side by side to see engage where everybody is during the summertime. And I think that was extremely important for this group, especially after having a sour taste in their mouth of not making it to the Eastern Conference finals last year, let alone outside of the Eastern Conference semifinals for the second year in a row. But Jimmy, this also poses another question for me, right? We talk about the load management issue for Donovan Mitchell. Donovan’s been at camps all summer. Donovan’s been in his camp run. Like, sure, you’re playing against high school prospects who are college hopefuls and all these things, but you’re still taxing your body, you’re still putting mileage on your body and maybe you’re not playing as hard. I will definitely not playing as hard. But we also know Donovan is a competitor and is also a teacher and is trying to instill in these kids how you’re supposed to go about your business. So I’m happy that he’s in the community. I’m happy that he’s getting acclimated with all of these different kids and showing them what is possible for them. But is that the best thing to be doing after coming off a cast break injury for the second year in a row? I don’t know. That’s my question. Also, obviously, Kenny Atkinson came into last season with a set plan, a set rest plan for the entire 2024, 2025 year. I expect that to be the same thing for 2025, 2026. It’s just about how many minutes players are going to play the rest days, how long those stretches of rest days are going to be, when they’re going to be wrestling and that goes into the questions that you have been asking Jimmy about is it 30 or 35 minutes? What is the perfect range? And I think they’re still figuring that out. But I also think, as I’ve said before on this podcast, Kenny Atkinson having a complete summer, not running around like a chicken with his head cut off, trying to be in France, trying to be in Los Angeles, trying to be in Cleveland, trying to be in Tennessee, trying to be all these other places he’s been able to know and have connection and relationships with all of these guys to the point where you can build off of what they are capable of because you’ve seen it in a full season. But also you know their body type, you know their mindset, and you know what they’re going to allow their bodies to do in part with the Max Schrouss thing. For him to be out for this long, for the second season in a row, to start the season, you know how much that’s going to hurt him and how quickly he’s going to try and get back. But Kenny Atkinson I think has the wherewithal to understand that he has to hold him out until he is a thousand percent ready to come back. Because the important part of the season comes much, much later, even after the new year. If that’s the case for Max Struse, you need to have him ready, ramped up, healthy, but also have enough gameplay to be physically capable of handling what the playoffs bring. Because that’s where all the eyes are going to be on Cleveland.
Jimmy Watkins: I just want to say real quick, I think two things about Donovan at camps. Number one, you can’t stop basketball players from being basketball players. Like dudes love hooping, they’re going to hoop in those runs, you know. Is Donovan building himself up to much pretty preparing for an NBA game? No, of course not. But I think that he’s definitely managing himself in those situations. He’s being careful. I trust wholeheartedly that Donovan Mitchell is not putting himself, is doing everything he can to not put himself at risk in any of those situations. I don’t think that’s a big deal.
Ethan Sands: I agree. I do think that basketball players are gonna hoop. I. I know just regular human beings. If you’re a Hooper, you wanna be on the court as much as possible. So at an NBA level, if you can be on the court, I think it’s a great experience for his campers. I think it’s a great experience for Donovan. I think when we talk about maybe his body needed more juice when it came to the end of the season because he didn’t get enough minutes. Because the Cavs said Kenny Atkinson said because there was a plan for him to ramp up a little bit more heading to the playoffs, but because they were blowing teams out, they didn’t get that opportunity. Maybe this is what Donovan needed. Who knows. We’re going to find out come this season. But I want to get to this last question from our subtexters. This one come from Lloyd in Mayfield Heights. He says last year the Cavs relied heavily on their guards for offense, which proves to be ineffective in the playoffs with the injuries to Darius Garland and Max Druce, plus the loss of Ty Jerome. Does this force Kenny ATKINSON to utilize DeAndre Hunter and especially Evan Mobley to generate offense? Even Jared Allen to a lesser extent? I think the quick answer is you would hope so, right? Because you, you need offensive fluctuation, you need it to flow, especially in the offense system that Kenny Atkinson wants to run. Multiple options is the best way to success. So DeAndre Hunter, Evan Mobley and Jared Allen, when it comes to the the first two, those are going to be the offensive fulcrum, right? DeAndre Hunter likely to come off the bench is going to be the main source of offense for that bench unit, whichever bench unit he is a part of. He is now taking on the role of Ty Jerome to be the consistent threat, to be the consistent scorer, whether from beyond the arc, whether from the mid range, which he’s so, so good at, but also getting acclimated to Kenny Atkinson’s system. And that’s part of what we were talking about a little bit earlier when I said Kenny Atkinson having a full summer. One of the things I wrote about dating Back to like May 30 was that Kenny Atkinson needs to get into the brain of DeAndre Hunter and learn how he wants to be used on this team. And that may be in part to what Chris has been talking about this summer, about DeAndre Hunter still being a six man because of what he’s learned. But DeAndre Hunter is going to be one of the most important players on this team because of how his role is going to increase and how he is going to need to have consistent success in this roster and in the new system, but also how Kenny Atkinson is going to utilize that system. Second of all, Evan Mobley is going to be the most important player on this team this year because I think we can all agree Donovan Mitchell is a top 15 player in the NBA. But the Cavs do not make it out of the Eastern Conference Finals If Evan Mobley is not the number one guy on this squad, and I think that means you need to have him touch the ball almost every time down the floor, initiating offense off defensive rebounds, getting into the transition game, utilizing him as a kickout as well and using him in every capacity possible that his game has grown into. And then Jared Allen, as we’ve talked on recent podcasts, needs to be a rebounder, a hard setter, a a pick and roller and also just an energy presence. Not necessarily he needs to touch the ball every time down the floor, but if he has a mismatch, use it. And I think there’s different aspects to each three of these players game that is going to be extremely important for the Cav’s success, especially at the beginning of the season. And As I mentioned, DeAndre Hunter and Evan Mobley are going to be pivotal to the playoff success of the Cleveland Cavaliers for this coming season.
Jimmy Watkins: So I’ll pick up where you left off. I think Ja should have the ball more at the beginning of the season. Who the heck else is going to have the ball? Donovan, Evan Mobikool, a lot more possessions. Give Jared Allen the ball. He’s proven himself as a passer. Let him make plays for nailville. Also Max Strus is out too and we’re looking for a way to get DeAndre Hunter more involved in the offense. Recreate the two man game. I mean that feels like a perfect, perfect way to try to get DeAndre Hunter more comfortable playing potentially with the core four. Oh, how about that? Get him on the court with Jared Allen. Let them run a little two man game. Let DeAndre Hunter get a little rhythm as a, as a ball handle scorer and a passer. The read is real simple. Do you think Jared Allen is going to catch this ball and dunk it? Throw the lob. If not, attack the rim or hit your midi. Hit your midi. Game, shoot a pull up, post up, shoot a turnaround, whatever. We know we can do that. But I’d like to see it. I’d like to see DeAndre Hunter, Jared Allen 2 Met game I’m like to know what that looks like. I think that’s an easy way for Kenny to try to get DeAndre Hunter feeling more comfortable within the flow of this offense. Right. Evan Mobley. It’s a blank canvas. Give him the paintbrush, what he can figure out. We always preface the Evan Mobley conversation by saying like, oh, we don’t need Evan Mobley to just get the ball in ISO and start dribbling around. Give him the ball. Let him ISO. Let him dribble around. What can he do? Let him show you. Let him build confidence with what he can do. Because in the playoffs, you’re going to need him to do some of these things eventually. I mean, can you think about. Okay, the Evan Moby development went pretty well last year, but come playoff time, he didn’t get the ball enough and he did, or he didn’t show enough or a little bit of A, a little bit of B. We’re still in the second round, man. If you’re not getting him involved enough or he’s not showing enough for you to get past the second round, we’re talk. We’re talking about you as a conference finalist. We’re talking about you as winning a championship. We need this Evan Mobley experiment to speed up, to take another big leap, okay? And I think it’s. It’s in there, but you got to give him a chance. And to me, the question is not about. This is a good question, by the way, Lloyd, if you’re cooking here. But to me, the question is, is less about whether they will diversify the offense early in the season with these guys out. They have to. They have no other choice. The question is whether it sustains when everybody comes back, when Darius is back and Max is back and Kenny can lean on the guard heavy offense again. Will you retain the lessons that you learned without everybody once everybody is back? Because I will say it again, I’m a broken record at this point. They spent all last season telling us that we. There was a changing of the guard happened and Donovan was taking a step back and he doesn’t do have to do everything at all. What a load off his shoulders. And then they put it all back on his shoulders again or he took it upon himself or a little bit of column, a little bit of column B. But like, yeah, I want to see it. I want to see everybody do a little bit more when these guys are out, and I want to see them keep doing it. Once everybody’s back, it’s going to be trickier because there’s going to be less touches to go around. That’s why you get paid the big bucks. Kenny Atkinson, that’s why Donovan Mitchell, I believe he can do this. He’s. He’s one of the. I think he’s one of the best leaders in the league. But we need you to trust when it gets hard, too. We need you to give the ball up when it’s hard. We need you to give. When the chips are down and you you’re not sure how everyone’s going to respond. You need to let them try. That’s, that’s the big thing to me, of course we’re going to see. We’re going to. We’re probably all, all three of us will write fun stories. Our job is to tell you what’s happening right then. And then, you know, the end part of every one of the stories will be, it’ll be, oh, DeAndre Hunter is doing well with the ball. Jared Allen’s doing more with the ball. Evan Mobley. Look at, look at this. This nice little new nuance that Evan Moby has added to this game. We might not have ever known about this nuance of Darius Garland and Max Schuse. I can get a look at the silver lining. The end of that is going to be, are you going to keep doing it in April? That’s what it’s about.
Ethan Sands: I think that’s a great point and I think that’s why everybody’s talking about the regular season matters to some capacity. But we’re waiting for the playoffs, right? Because the biggest step that Donovan Mitchell has to take, it’s not in leadership, it’s not in points, it’s not in myths. It’s, are you willing to stand on what your belief has been all season or was all last season? It could be different this year. I don’t expect it to be. When you talk about Donovan Mitchell saying that he’s going to take a step back and then not physically not being capable of doing that in the playoffs, that stood out to me. Right. And that was one of the first articles I wrote in the playoffs this last year. Is donovan Mitchell attempting 30 shots is not the good sign that you want it from Donovan Mitchell. It’s a red flashing light that showcased that there was something there, whether subconsciously or consciously, that he wasn’t ready to let go. Are you now ready? Because this team doesn’t have a whole lot of time left on the clock ticking away to see if they’re capable of getting where this organization believes it can go. So I think the most important word from Lloyd’s question that I just wanted to dive into just for a quick second is he says force Kenny Atkinson, because Kenny Atkinson has seemed. Not that he didn’t want to, but he wanted to do it his way. He didn’t want to necessarily thrust into something that, that he was not comfortable with. The Evan Mobley offense, obviously, we know that he mentioned this. It’s going to have to be more this season. And DeAndre Hunter he simply just didn’t know enough to go into that. All of last season, especially in the playoffs where Jimmy mentioned it, DeAndre Hunter had one practice and DeAndre Hunter was playing with one thumb basically as he was still dealing with the dislocated thumb during the Indiana Pacers series.
Jimmy Watkins: I also just want to say, yes, it’s a Kenny conversation, but we can’t have it both ways. Where Kenny tells us it’s the player led off, it’s, it’s free flowing, the players set the culture and then we blame it all on Kenny when the offense isn’t as diverse as we want. Definitely some of it is on Kenny. You’re in charge here, my guy. So if you don’t like, if you think Evan Molly needs more touches, that’s on you. That’s on you. It’s also on the guys who you’re giving all this free flowing power to though, like Donna Mitchell. You’re saying a lot of nice things about Evan Mobley. Give him the ball. Terrius Garland, you’re calling Evan Moody the best player on the team. Give him the ball. Right. And so maybe, maybe the answer is Kenny needs to take a little bit of that free flowing spectrum back, swing the pendulum the other way and say, hey, on this possession we’re going to run a more rigid set with the goal in mind of getting Evan with them all.
Ethan Sands: Yeah. And 1000%. And you mentioned the two man game between DeAndre Hunter and Evan Mobley or DeAndre Hunter and Jared Allen. I am of the belief that at base level DeAndre Hunter needs to become a better facilitator this season. Right. Obviously we know that he is a great scorer. He’s going to be one of the most important scorers, especially if he’s coming off the bench. But DeAndre Hunter has never averaged more than two assists in a season, which is jarring. Right. And that kind of goes into the point of why he might not be in the starting lineup. Because ball movement stops with DeAndre Hunter because if he sees a shot that he likes, he’s going to take it. Statistically in it is proven he is going to take it. And that’s not a bad thing, especially in a six man role. When you talk about a guy that is needed to get the offense going, needed for his scoring. But if we’re going to talk about this two man game, well, you averaging 1.5 assists per game over your career is not going to cut it. Right. And I think he also is going to have bigger opportunity with better big men around him than he did have in Atlanta. Obviously, Clint Capella at one time was great, but now you have Jared Allen and Evan Mobley to choose from. You can run double actions, dual actions, if you will, with DeAndre, Evan and Jared, depending on who’s on the floor to figure out what you want, what you need and where you want the players to be at. But at face level, as I mentioned, I think DeAndre Hunter this season is going to need to be a better passer. That’s one of the biggest areas where I need to see him improve his game for him to make an impact on the Cavs because we know he has the scoring and we know that Kenny Atkinson is going to want to move the ball. But two things can be true. I just don’t think these two things can be true. You cannot have ball movement and have a player that’s not willing to give the ball up or isn’t likely to to give the ball up. It can’t get stuck. You don’t want DeAndre Hunter to end up feeling like a black hole.
Jimmy Watkins: Amen. It’s kind of a cop out. I’m with you. I’ve said this myself, but I think it’s kind of a cop out to be like, well, DeAndre Hunter wasn’t asked to be a facilitator. And then there’s thoughts. Okay, that’s true. But like, if you’re a good passer, it doesn’t really matter what you’re asked to do. Like, you’re just going to read the game out and it’s going to come naturally to you. Like, DeAndre Hunter is pretty clearly a score first guy. That’s okay. We have a role for you that suits that. But while you’re doing that job at a high level, which you do, we’re so pleased with the way you can score the ball efficiently. Particularly, we were in some tricky spots last year where you’re still trying to get your feet wet in an offense that was flowing perfectly without you. Like, while you’re doing all that stuff, can you meet us in the middle here and hit us with a swing to the corner every now and again? And to my earlier point, we’ll give you a vehicle to throw the ball to Jared Allen, go get it on a dribble handoff and run a little pick and roll. That’s your start right there. Right there. Then you’re either throwing a loud Jerry, you’re getting a bucket for yourself, or maybe someone came down to help off Jerry and it’d be awesome if you saw that and then kicked it to whoever that defender was responsible for. A three Start there, See what happens. It doesn’t. Again, no one’s asking DeAndre Hunter to be Darius Garland as a passer or Donovan Mitchell as a passer. Just make a few extra simple reads. Keep a wider scope of vision on the court. Slightly wider. That’s it. Small ask.
Ethan Sands: And with all that being said, that’ll wrap up today’s episode of the Wine and Gold Talk podcast. But remember to become a CAS insider and interact with Chris, me and Jimmy by subscribing to Subtext. If you want to get a shout out on the podcast, you want to have your questions answered on the show, this is where you can send in all of your thoughts and questions for us to discuss on the podcast. To do so, sign up for a 14 day free trial or visit cleveland.comcavs and click on the blue bar at the top of the page. If you don’t like it, that’s fine. All you have to do is tap text the word stop. It’s easy, but we can tell you that the people who signed up stick around. This is the best way to get insider coverage on the Cavs from me, Chris and Jimmy. This isn’t just our podcast, it’s your podcast. And the only way to have your voice heard is through subtext. Y’ all be safe. We out.
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